You'll have to excuse my short sentences, wee girl on shoulder plus entertaining 3 year old healthy boy!

As many of you know Zoe was diagnosed with reflux (like her bro) and is on Losec. She is still on a low dose (10mg) and had been doing reallty well. Most of the time she has been a happy healthy girl, still spilly, coughed at night, ear infections but generally well in herself. Well, the last month has been a downhill slide.

I weaned zoe a month ago so now suspect this is the issue ie... i weaned her on to soy milk. I feel like an idiot asking these questions but i bf fin until he was 22 months so really have no idea what is normal for a bottle fed bub. Basically after a milk feed she coughs a lot, it kind of catches, then she chucks (usually about 4 tablespoons). Zoe coughs a lot at night, and is also doing a lot of gargling through the day iykwim.

On top of that she has had double ear infections for the last 7 days, including the high temps etc. She is now coughing and chucking more. When I say chucking I think it is because she is coughing so hard that she expels stomach contents, or may be reflux? god, I don't know anything now. She doesn't have chest infec or tonsilitis so it's not phlegm. It's always possible t is a virus and the cough is part of that.

She is still dairy free (diet wise) so i don't think it is related to that. Is it likely to be the soy or am I just joining dots just because there is a corelation not a cause-effect relationship. If it is soy, then what is next step? Should I go to paed or is there something I can trial myself?

She's just turned 1... I thought we'd be done with this (well, i didn't really as fin still has issues from time to time but i was hopeful)

Sorry, a bit of a ramble - tia for your words of wisdom and experience.

Hi Megan,
I just wanted to mention that Briony (dairy intolerant) can't tolerate soy milk through my breastmilk.
She can actually tolerate small amounts of "health" cows milk yogurt the past almost 2 months - *ie not most commercial types which have milk solids added - but definitely not soy milk yet. I used to have soy in my coffee instead of regular milk but we realised it could be causing her distress so I tried ricemilk but decided just to take it black. Trialled soy a couple of weeks ago and she was really unhappy although she didn't bring any milk up.
I heard, not from a med professional, (in fact I think I read on here earlier in the year) that if a child has a problem with dairy they often do with soy too. I guess your best option is a trial elimination? I'm not sure what the soy/dairy link is...one is animal & one is vegetable!

I'm wondering if Zoe might do better of one of the allergenic baby milks that have all the proteins broken down, rather than soy?

Sorry to hear about the ear infections. I heard from a friend in Wellington who said her son has been unwell most of the past month....lots of bugs going around with the weather warming up I expect.

I hope someone with more similar experience to yours can offer some good advice!
I hope to wean Briony around 13 months after our trip home but I have no idea what milk to wean her on to yet...

Best to you,
Joanna.

Joanna

I have tried most of the store-bought formulas earlier on and Zoe couldn't deal with them (and that was fairly instant intolerance iykwim). I haven't tried rice milk so could do that. I could do what I did with Fin and go no milk whatsoever however the big difference is that Fin can deal with cheese and yoghurt. So, for Zoe (aside from broccolli) she doesn't get calcium from other sources (and the soy is fortified).

Megan

Hi again,

I was dairy free until the yogurt intro recently and the doctor I saw mentioned that if using rice milk the things I needed to supplement with were good fats (olive oil, salmon etc) calcium/magnesium (even though it's fortified with ca.) and some extra protein because rice milk is pretty much just carbohydrate.
I would definitely be happy using it for Briony though...with extra supps.

The formulas I was thinking of with the proteins completely broken down are the ones like Nutrimigen (not sure of the brands over there) but I think they might be prescription only???

We already think we probably won't go the formula route...more likely rice milk with a really good diet, plus some supps for fat etc.

Aren't food intolerances a pain!!!!!

Joanna

Sounds like you are fighting a number of possibilities, with the ear and viral stuff and the dietary changes.

Nutritionally rice milk even the enriched stuff is pretty poos, but a change to that could help you tell if soy is the exacerbator.

The losec question
I would suggest that her dosage could still be ok, but that it may need increasing if the refluxing is more frequent. e.g. the dosage may be ok for her a month ago when she was DF and BF, but now with the changes in her diet maybe not so. However a losec increase is only going to control the pain, not sort out what seems to be the new problem.

Regarding calcium intake
Ian is on neocate, and has still been recommended to take a calcium supplment - we use the Thompsons one in a capsule. However the dietician did say that if I were to stop the neocate to still only take the same dosage of the supplement.

I managed to get a bit of light shed on our potential issues by getting my DH allergy tested - and those results (soy, peanut, wheat, dustmites, grasses) have given me more guidance than any allergy testing on Ian - so you and your DH could get some allergy testing done and that is something 'you' can do.

If you want some neocate - PM me.

Cheers

Sounds like dairy to me......
She might be a bit old to get onto neocate though, the stuff taste awful. But we are still putting brown sugar and vanilla in it, so you could do the same.

I'd say the best thing to do would be to see a paed and have a chat.
And like Fi said she made need a meds review after her dietery changes.
You could also try the Karicare HA formula. Its the first stop in hypo-allergenic formulas. The proteins are slighty broken down in it. It goes:
normal formula
Karicare HA
Pepti Junior
Neocate


Ear infections and reflux go hand and hand too. The liquids coming up the throat go into the ears and get infected. Emily got grommets at 11 months and will probably get another set next winter.

Hope things improve for you.
This reflux merry-go-round is NOT the best ride at the circus!!!

PS..... I could spare you some neocate if you wanted to try it too, but be quick as my number runs out at the end of the month and then I won't have any more.

meg- I wish I had suggestions and answers for you babe but i dont. My only suggestion would be to try the rice milk? and or take Zoe back to your gp and get them to access the losec dosage. Is she teething on top of the ear infections etc? Maybe its the virus that agravating the reflux and it will all settle when shes 'well' again. Sorry long rambles with not alot of point. Hugs babe and thanks for your support on msn.

HUGS

just a suggestion :-). is she just learning to walk? if so, all the up & down movement can exacerbate reflux symptoms. This can be excluded as a possible factor if shes already walking well.
Hope you manage to get it sorted.
K.

My first step would be to get her ears checked, he she teething? I would also stop the soy milk as the problems seem to have ezasberated since them and maybe try rice milk if that fails get to get Neocate presribed. The night coughing and gagging is a sign of reflux(in our house), maybe try a gavison sachet during the night when she is coughing and see if that helps, that will give you your answer to if it is reflux.I had the same issues as you in regard to breastfeeding for me it was 26mths and found all the "alternative milks" not appropriate.
Good Luck I hope it improves shortly for you.

Hi all,

thanks for all your ideas. I ended up deciding the coughing was due to the ear infecs mostly as it did subside as the ears got better, however she's been getting worse with vomiting (especially at night) plus some diarrhoea. At first we thought it was tummy bug but then noticed it was happening straight after or within a couple of hours of having soy milk. So, we went cold turkey with no soy milk, just water, and within 24 hours she wasn't vomiting, she only woke twice in night. At least if she's not vomitting the Losec has a chance to actually work too.

I'm just waiting for advice as to whether I can actually avoid "milk" altogether and source calcium from elsewhere, or whether it is worth trying Neocate at this stage.

Thank again for your help. You experience and ideas certainly helped me work through it all.

Megan