Hi wizz. Sorry to hear things are no better. I am trying to think back to remember how long it took to see an improvement on the lower losec dose. It is really hard as those months are pretty hazy!!! I think it took a few days, probably less than a week. With us, the increased losec made DD go from waking every hour to not being able to put her down and her writhing around all night in my arms having to constantly jiggle her and keep her absolutely vertical. I think after a couple of days on the lower dose her really sore tummy stopped and I could at least put her down in bed for a short period. She still would wake every hour though with wind issues and my DD1 was the same. To be honest I still don't feel like I got to the bottom of it with either - I think they just outgrew it finally. Solids at four months and my DD learning to sit independently at four months seemed to help heaps. She seemed to be able to bring up her own wind much easier. If he is on neocate though it is a tough one. Have you tried different teat sizes/makes? I seriously considered expressing and bottle feeding my DD as my milk flow was really fast but exhaustion meant I never got round to it. If you want to give the coliccalm a go send me your address and I will post you some. I only have a half opened bottle though. It is a homeopathic remedy and I am sure it helped DD a bit. Might be worth a try. Fingers crossed something works for you soon.

Ooh forgot to say - interesting to hear about your wee boy's snuffly nose and breathing problems as DD2 is the same. She wheezes away all the time and always seems to have a really mucousy chest even if she doesn't have a cold.

Our boy found the higher doses of losec hard going too, and ended up refusing all his feeds. Just a thought though, as this was suggested to us by the gastro paed. If you think that the lower dose won't be enough to control the reflux, there may be a possibility of having him on a lower dose of losec and a small dose of ranitidene also.

wizz, how are you getting on? DD2 got sick at around 6 weeks and it made everything hideous and took ages to recover.

4-5 months was the turning point for us and by 6 months we had an almost model baby Hope you find the same

Hi Wuz

Still no change Im affraid. We got his allergy test results back which were thankly showed no allergy to milk, soy, egg and peanuts, cats and dogs. But it picked up on low iron and mild allergy to something which is likey to be environmental and will need skin prick tests done at 12mnths. Ive decreased the losec from 20mg to 10mg over a week ago now to see if it would help with the tummy pain but is hasnt helped at all. The paed said it should only take three days to see a difference. Ive not desperatly bought some dr browns bottles to see if that will help witht he wind etc. Today is day two on them and I have not seen a difference yet. He still needs movement to get to sleep and still wont sleep in cot yet during the day. I can get him to sleep in his cot at night from around 21.00pm untill 1am when the pain and squriming kicks in. Its frustrating as daughter also calmed down around the 4mnth mark where all of a sudden you could put her into bed without being rocked and she would just goo off to sleep. Every day I try with Flynn and he just wakes up continously. Even in his swing he will wake up alot. But apart from the really bad sleeping and sore tummy he can be such a delight during the day , all smiles.

Wizz, did you try an osteo? I can't remember now. I wonder if it is a colicky wind thing - I reckon DD2 would have been exactly as you describe if the merbentyl hadn't sorted things out at 3 months. Have you tried Weleda ChamRad20x - I doubt it will fix it but it might just take the edge off???? I hope things settle for you - babies needing constant movement and only sleeping upright on mum is VERY tiring but it is also hard to see them sooo uncomfortable.

Hi Wuzz

He was seeing a chiro from birth untill 10 weeks which is when I stopped as it was costing me a fortune and he was getting worse not better so it didnt help at all. I havnt triend the weleda chamrad20x yet but tired there colic one.

I just dont understand what the problem is as this only started up after his 3 mnth jabs. And its getting worse. The lowerin of the losec didnt help at all. Last night was a really bad night. Didnt get him to sleep untill 9.30 then was back up at 11.30 and then 1am and then every ten mins untill 6.30am. Im seeing the paed again tomorrow so will be interesting to see what he suggests this time.

How is the tummy problem going for you wizz?

My DS is almost 6 months. He gets a hard tummy and screams. It was happening around 3 months and died down a bit and came back at 5 months.

I'm considering reducing his losec but he's only on 10mg in the AM (plus 1ml ranitidine at 1pm and 5mg losec before bedtime)

Hi Edesanja

Sorry to hear your in the same boat. Its hard work isnt it! Last week was the week from hell with Flynn. Tuesday night he had breathing difficulties due to the reflux and it was quite scary. He was fine wed thrus with the usual sqirming at night and waking. Friday night he screamed non stop from 9pm untill 3am in the morning and every time I got him off to sleep and put him down or lay down with him he would wake up screaming. It was horrible. He seemed ok to me the next day. And then at 2am sunday morning it started again and he screamed non stop. I got my hubby up at 5am to take over as I was just to tired to deal with it and got back up at 6.30am and he was still at it. I took him to a&e they checked him out and just told me it was colic and there wasnt much you could do about it. I was dreading sunday night but I forgot to give him his pm 10mg dose of losec and he was back to his usual self. Still waking and sqirming but easy to settle and no screaming. Ive keep him on just the 10mg dose of losec am and have not been giving him his pm dose. Im too scared to now. I have no idea weather that was what caused it but he seems to be doing ok without it. My paed thinks he should be on 20mg so Im going to rediscuss it with him at his next appointment.
Im tempted to give him a pm dose to see if anything happens but just so hesitant. Flynn is also having his 5mnt vaccinations tomorrow so Im not looking forward to that as he screamed all night last time after his shots and went off his feeds for a few weeks. Fingers crossed he doesnt react to them this time.

Wizz, if he isn't in more reflux pain on the 10mg dose then I can't see any need to give more. Personally, I'd keep him on the lower dose and see how he goes. If he continues to be better at night and doesn't seem to deteriorate reflux wise then I'd leave it like that. Whatever gives you the happier baby.

You're game getting the jabs done. We haven't been back for those since the hideous unsettledness post the 6week ones done at 10 weeks. I don't know what I'm going to do there. Bubs now 7.5 months.

Wizz,
I'd seriously give the paed a call first before you tinker with doses. You need to work as a team with the paed and if either of you are off doing your own thing you can't work together for the best for Flynn.

Just as a random eg you know about Thomas having all these eating/swallowing issues atm? He's on the list for a scope after the barium swallow from h*ll a few weeks back.
The surgeon's put him on mylanta and omeprazole in the meantime to see if it'll help.
Today I had a call offering T a cancellation slot for his scope tomorrow - but the surgeon's asked for him to be off meds for 10 days at least beforehand so we couldn't take it.

I have seen no difference at all for T on the meds as off them so I'm going to stick it out for the rest of the week and then contact the surgeon on Monday and tell him what I've seen and ask that he come off the meds now. Then we can tell the hosp that they can put him on the cancellation list for 10 days time. If anything comes up then he could potentially have his scope 2 weeks earlier than predicted - good result for all.

Even though I don't believe for 1 second the meds are helping his gloopies I'm not taking him off until I can talk to the surgeon. We have a good working relationship and a partnership in T's care. I don't want him booking things without telling me, I want to be sure he's keeping all T's medical caregivers in the loop, we have to communicate and collaborate or things don't get done. If you respect the medical bods then usually, not always but usually, they'll respect you. They may be the medical experts but I'M the Thomas expert.

I agree with what you are saying Eleanor but I know that if I were in the same situation as wizz, I would keep him off the meds until the next appointment given that she is now 4 days into a reduced dose and by the sounds of it he is heaps happier. If that changes then she could always put his dose back up. That is actually useful information for the paed. Sometimes you just have to go for the lesser of two evils - crampy tummy or less controlled reflux - I know when DD2's colic was REALLY bad, it was way worse than any reflux pain she had ever had, way way worse.

We recently tried dropping DD2 evening dose (so 10mg in morning only) and she was no different for about 3 days then seemed like something wasn't right (she was holding her tongue out a lot) but didn't necessarily seem like it was reflux. I ended up giving her the night dose again but the next day she was full of cold and had a viral rash so I would say her seeming off was a virus rather than the lower dose. Anyway, it was still useful for me to try her on a lower dose as, when I try again soon, if she does the funny tongue thing again I will know that it is about the reflux etc etc.

Good luck wizz, do what you think is right.

I would ahve thought the colic would have gone now cos that usually goes around 3 months. Hmm, in saying that DD2s was really bad at 3 months so we used merbentyl and it was gone with using that over 3 days. ANyway, at this point in time I'd be thinking that it might be the losec irritating things too as it is known to cause crampiness.

Have you tried massage? There are some good ones you can do to help move gas through etc. It wasn't a cure for DD2 but it might be worth a go, in the least you feel like you are trying to help...

I have ended up reducing J's morning dose of losec from 10mg to 5mg (he was on 10mg in AM, 1ml ranitidine at 1pm, 5mg in PM). It has possibly helped a bit but it hasn't solved the problem (and I'm not even sure it's not just a conincidence). (I didn't check with the paed but at our last appointment 3months ago he wanted to decrease it. We tried and it didn't work so we put it back up. I didn't think it would be against his wishes to try again).

Today he was fussy feeding again - pulling on and off like he used to do. Today was day 4 of reducing the morning dose. How long should we allow for rebound? Or should I call it quits and just put it back up since it hasn't totally cured the tummy problem either?

Hi Eleanor

Thanks for the advice. My paed is in the loop with his losec dose. I initially lowered flynns dose from 20 to 10mg about a 6 weeks ago after speaking to my paed on the phone and getting the go ahead. In that time for I saw no difference with his windy clolicky tummy and found I was still up with him all night. I also did not see any difference with his reflux ie: he didnt seem to be suffering with the lower dose. We did have that night a couple of weeks back where he had trouble with his breathing but I dont think that was from the lack of losec. (with cassie whenever we dropped her dose she was a nightmare) We saw the paed the following week and I talked to him then about the lowering of the dose and he then said that no he needs to be back on 20mg so that night I put him back on it and thats when hell broke lose and screaming went on for 6hrs and then he just stopped and started untill 6am. The next night was the samebut started at 2am in the morning and was still going at 8am in the morning. Now it could be coincindence of course but he did not have his losec the next night and he was so much better. So even though yes I should inform my paed and get his go ahead but he is on holiday right now and I cant thing of anthing worse than having him screaming all night again. Im also up around 10 time a night with Cassie at the moment and still havnt gotten to the bottom of whats wrong with her yet. Once she has settled down Ithink I will feel more confident with trying Flynn back on the 20mg even though I really dont think he needs it but will be interested to see what happens. He still has alot of wind some nights which starts around 3am but its not constant screaming, its just alot of wriggling and suirming which I just walk with him untill it passes.

wuz..I said the same thing to the dr at a&e...I thought colic was meant to be gone by five mnths not start. But he told me they can still have colic at that age. I went ahead and got him vaccinated and Im glad I did now as this time round there was no reaction at all. Im wondering if its because his reflux is so much better.

Edesanja..when he pulls off when he feeds it could also be to do with wind. Try sitting up straight when he does this and see if you can get any wind out. I know with flynn when he does this its because of the wind more so than the reflux. Ive started putting ifalcol in every bottle he has and Im not to sure if its a coincidence or not but there is less spilling, pulling off and seems to be better at night. I have tried ifacol before but didnt see the results Im getting now. As for the rebound they recommend atleast 7 days so try and stick with it for another 3 days if you can. And then if no better than give the dose back up again. Its hard work heh.

Eleanor how is Thomas doing? I have now idea how you surive. I read what you wrote for the newsletter and made me cry. Your are won strong lady. Hugs

Edesanja

Im not sure if you are breast feeding or not but flynn is now on the bottle and I swithed from avent to dr browns bottles which are meant to be fantastic for wind and I have to say even thought it didnt happen straight away I have seen a big improvement with the change...maybe that is why he is less windy. I find that if I have no dr browns bottles left Ive used an avent and he has been really unsettled drinking and after having the bottle.

The pulling off isn't usually what happens if he's got wind. In the past it has meant reflux. It's like he's wincing from reflux and so pulls off.

We use Tommee Tippee closer to nature bottles and infacol

I've decided today to switch to Neocate for 3/4 feeds. It's just too hard with the 'what if' factor when I'm breastfeeding and he's starting solids. I so hope that it solves our tummy issues!

That's interesting about the bottles wizz. Maybe he just wasn't getting a good seal on the avent ones? They are a different teat shape too. I found avent useless for a fussy feeder, DD1 could bend the teat around too much. We ended up moving her to Nuk. DD2 I started out on Evenflo teats (which are almost identical to the Dr Brown ones), tried her on the Nuk ones but she couldn't drink from those so she stayed on the Evenflo ones.

Did you ever try the Weleda Cham Rad 20x? I used it every bottle and I actually think it helps. We ran out for a few days and she was doing short day sleeps. DH got some more Sat night, started using again on Sunday morning and that day she had 2x 2h sleeps, good sleeps again today... it does say on it that it can help for occasional sleeplessness etc too. I was recommended it to help with colic by the Plunket Family Centre. Might be worth a try???? You could give with the infacol and it is easy as you just add to the bottle as well.

Edesanja, yeah I find it hard to work out if its wind or reflux when Flynn pulls off. I gave him a feed out of one of our tommee tippee closer to nature bottles yesterday as I had washed all the dr browns bottles up and he pulled after every 10mls with a scream. Ive tried and tested alot of bottle lol I hope going on neocate helps his tummy. Flynn is soley on neocate and still has tummy problems. Dont forget that if its an allergy giving him sore tummys even though your wont be soley breast feeding it will still pass through the milk and upset his tummy. It know for sure if its an allergen upsetting his tummy you would have to use the neocate and not breast feed and it can take up to 3 weeks to see a difference. With flynn when he was being breast fed he would wake screaming every ten mins at night and after being on neocate for 6-8 weeks is when I saw a huge difference with his sleeping. Still not the best sleeper though.

Wuz- I went to the chemist last week to get some cham rad but they didnt have any so thought I would try somewhere ealse but just havent had the chance. We are in the country
with one chemist and the next one is half an hour away. I also want to get some digestrodoron. Im managing to get flynn to have one sleep a day in his cot but its not for long buts it alot better than what he was doing. I have a booklet I picked up at the chemist about weleda remedies for mother and child. Under colic it doest even list cham rad as remedy. Its got the colic powder and also mentions for severe cases of colic to gently massage oxails 10% ointment into the babies abdomen and give 5 drops of chamomilla/nicotiana comp. And for breat feeding babies mums to drink lactagogue tea four times a day to relieve the colic in the baby. So there we are a few other remedys to try if one doesnt work lol. How much does the cham rad cost?

As for the teats on the bottles, avent and dr browns are pretty much identical from what I can see the only difference is the dr browns teats are more flexible and squishy. The avent ones are alot more stronger feeling.

Weleda Cham Rad 20x is for teething. There is also Cham RAd 3x??? which is for colic but the 20x is stronger and what the Fmaily Centre recommended. The 20x bottle also says can help with sleeplessness The colic powder is essentially the cham rad in a powder form (with losec) rather than in solution. It is maybe $14 a bottle.

I think you should get through this site
http://www.healthy.co.nz/search/results/a721df683919e0e560415cd5a577550e
They don't have it on their website but if you email them with what you want, they will get it in for you and then post to you. (They have done this for me before with other weleda products). I buy stuff from them a lot (they have a shop close to me too), free delivery if you spend over $50.

or here
http://www.healthpost.co.nz/Supplements/...hing-Drops.html
http://www.healthpost.co.nz/Product/WLDIG/Digestodoron
they also have the 3x colic drops if you would prefer those over the 20x
http://www.healthpost.co.nz/Product/WLCHRC/Cham-Rad-3x-Colic-Drops